Black Stork Nest in Karula, 2021

Cameras Watching over Black Storks nest
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Tatiana60
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Re: Black Stork Nest in Karula, 2021

Post by Tatiana60 »

Solo wrote: August 26th, 2021, 4:33 pm Urmas: ... "Tuul ... was killed by predator most probably in 18th of August and later eaten by racoon dogs...."
:cry:
I'm crying for our baby Tuul... I understand about the inevitable victims among young birds..., but it is very bitter.... It remains to be hoped that at least some of the children of Estonian storks will survive... there's nothing we can do about it...
Photo Tuul 16.08.2021, 12: 08.
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... how can I put this sadness into words?
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Post by Solo »

Tatiana60 wrote: August 28th, 2021, 5:30 pm ... how can I put this sadness into words?
:hi: Tatiana,
I am every time speechless when something like this happened ...
(even now I have goosebumps, my throat tightened and my eyes filled with tears I can barely see what I'm writing)
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Tatiana60
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Post by Tatiana60 »

Solo wrote: August 28th, 2021, 5:40 pm ...(even now I have goosebumps, my throat tightened and my eyes filled with tears I can barely see what I'm writing)...
it's good when you're not alone at such moments...(I also know about the troubles in the second Estonian nest...)
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Post by Rauntz »

Anne7 wrote: August 4th, 2021, 1:29 pm Here you are, Solo.

It is a text written by Māris Strazds, on 7 July 2021 at 21:53
It concerns the 'belated' storklets on the Latvian nest, Sigulda county

https://www.facebook.com/DzivibasLidoju ... 6938084532

"... Although the condition of the young birds in the nests inspected so far has been 'overall good' to 'very good', the storklets will need to spend at least one more month in the nest (much longer in this nest) and the situation can deteriorate very quickly. Although I do not want this to happen, I suggest that we start to get used to the idea that the story of this nest may end this way, this year. If it doesn't, that would be great, but the chances of these chicks to get regular feedings are diminishing with every hot day.
I also want to state straight away that I will not organise any "rescue".
A person can stack a mountain of fish in a nest, but no single human can "tell" the chicks how to forage for food (which the parents do), "tell" them how to build a nest (which they also do), or "tell" them where to fly to (migrate). The only thing that can be done with such storklets is take them to the Zoo for the rest of their lives. If it appeases the webcam viewers, they can try to contact the Zoo themselves and deal with it ..."


I remember reading the same opinion elsewhere as well. But I don't remember if it was on the forum, or in some article.
There is no point in me looking for it now, because I have no idea anymore when or where it was. Maybe it will ‘pop up’ again.

Edit:
Frankly, I am not surprised that BS storklets need their natural environment and their parents to grow up in a healthy way (physically and mentally), and to successfully develop their natural skills and innate instincts.
We all know how scared BS are of humans. They freeze and sometimes even throw up in fear. You know that too. This fear causes an adrenaline rush in their bodies. Which in turn affects the other hormone levels. If they are forced to be in permanent (or frequent) contact with humans, such prolonged hormonal disruptions have far-reaching consequences for their well-being. It affects their growth, their weight, their digestion, their behaviour, etc…
And by the time they have become accustomed to human proximity, they have become ‘pets’ rather than wild birds. Or maybe worse: neither the one, nor the other.

We can say now that Māris Strazds is total ...
We NEVER witnessed that mother or father teached how to forage to fish or how to migrate.
That's a fact based on GPS tracker so ... no need to listen what Māris Strazds has to say ... non of this is true.

hocus pocus ... not based on facts !

very easy to prove!
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Post by chrisitz »

dear storkfriends!
I was out for some days, came home and had to read all these horror news that happened during my journey in the estonian nests and we dont know what happended with our latvian storks. I hope so much for our storks, wish them long lifes and beautiful flights.
I am so sad with you .
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Heloise
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Post by Heloise »

Chrisitz :hi: yes, it´s very sad...

This nest is now empty until next spring...
...
But Karl II had a little guest today :rolleyes:

European Crested Tit

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Post by Liz01 »

Rauntz wrote: August 30th, 2021, 8:58 am We can say now that Māris Strazds is total ...
We NEVER witnessed that mother or father teached how to forage to fish or how to migrate.
That's a fact based on GPS tracker so ... no need to listen what Māris Strazds has to say ... non of this is true.

hocus pocus ... not based on facts !


very easy to prove!
Unbelievable what you write! :slap:

Are you taking a nest as evidence? You never heard of statistics, did you? If you extrapolate one nest to the entire population, that is absolutely not proof of anything.
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asteria
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Post by asteria »

I saw skuas robbing terns(and probably other birds) but who else can do that? A WTE or a Blakiston's fish owl?
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Post by Rauntz »

Liz01 wrote: August 30th, 2021, 1:51 pm Unbelievable what you write! :slap:

Are you taking a nest as evidence? You never heard of statistics, did you? If you extrapolate one nest to the entire population, that is absolutely not proof of anything.
c'mon we have transmitters and we can see if father and siblings were together, right?

what are you thinking?

what evidence you need ... 1+1=2 :puzzled:
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Post by Liz01 »

Rauntz,

Maris Strazds speaks of adult birds, not of parents!
A translation from a foreign language should not be presented as a fact. Errors in the translation are inevitable if no one who speaks this language checks the translation for accuracy. I always make mistakes when translating ... also from Estonian to English

It is a fact that they meet in larger groups. There are countless pictures and videos where you can see it.
So how do you know they don't learn how to fish from adults? Do you have any other evidence? If yes, which?

I have no idea when the leader time starts. Maybe you should ask an ornithologists who has observed it?

And you should be honest and just admit that we only have fragmentary knowledge and nothing else! And certainly not be so arrogant, and explain here that a respected ornithologist is telling nonsense .. Lies that one should not believe.


EDIT:
We cannot even correctly interpret what we are reading (me too!)
He wrote this in connection with leaving the chicks. If after 3 or 4 weeks the parents had decided to leave the chicks (that would be a possible scenario) and you would have drive to nest a few times a day to throw fish in .. what then?

I have no idea about any of this. But it is conceivable that the younger they are when they are abandoned, the less they will be able to survive later. I am sure that in the nest they will learn a lot from their parents. Is that worth considering?

learning just by watching. They imitate what the parents do. We could see and document that. Arrange branches ect ...
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Post by Rauntz »

Liz01 wrote: August 30th, 2021, 7:46 pm Rauntz,

Maris Strazds speaks of adult birds, not of parents!
A translation from a foreign language should not be presented as a fact. Errors in the translation are inevitable if no one who speaks this language checks the translation for accuracy. I always make mistakes when translating ... also from Estonian to English

It is a fact that they meet in larger groups. There are countless pictures and videos where you can see it.
So how do you know they don't learn how to fish from adults? Do you have any other evidence? If yes, which?

I have no idea when the leader time starts. Maybe you should ask an ornithologists who has observed it?

And you should be honest and just admit that we only have fragmentary knowledge and nothing else! And certainly not be so arrogant, and explain here that a respected ornithologist is telling nonsense .. Lies that one should not believe.

Liz01, if you read what he spoke then that's totally different what you are saying.
"A person can stack a mountain of fish in a nest, but no single human can "tell" the chicks how to forage for food (which the parents do), "tell" them how to build a nest (which they also do), or "tell" them where to fly to (migrate)."

After migration starts there will be no contact from parents so it can only happen during the period when chicks are flying out of nest before migration.
So, i'm honest and reading what he said and as i said it's easily proven from Karl nest and Jan nest that this is not happening.

All those facts have not happening here, sorry but it's true.
I don't have to have "fragmentary knowledge" just observing like we all.
And what lies ... i'm just stating events what has really happening.

You better show me how parent "A person can stack a mountain of fish in a nest, but no single human can "tell" the chicks how to forage for food (which the parents do), "tell" them how to build a nest (which they also do), or "tell" them where to fly to (migrate)."
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Post by aquiline »

:wave:

Pikne's decision not to start immediately but waiting a little and eating much fish reminds me of - was it Karula?

So perhaps it is a good omen for Pikne's hopefully many journeys :2thumbsup:
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Post by Anne7 »

September 11th

:hi:

There was a beautiful visitor on the nest at about 12:19. 8-)

Image

Image

Image
“Clearly, animals know more than we think, and think a great deal more than we know.”
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Anne7
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Post by Anne7 »

.
A PS in the nest ...
Image

... and out again ...
Image
“Clearly, animals know more than we think, and think a great deal more than we know.”
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Post by Polly »

very very pretty. :innocent:

A buzzard? The beak and length of the tail feathers are not suitable for goshawk or falcon. (Not really dress either)

Why do they poop in strange nests? Although they would never use these nests for breeding anyway?

If I understand correctly, this is a demonstration of possessiveness. :help:
"Throw your heart across the river and swim after it."
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Post by Swenja »

Sometimes this season it was like hearing a buzzard calling. :nod:

There was wonder if it was a jay mimicking buzzard calls. It was difficult to assign the calls.
But it was probably actually the calls of a buzzard.


Many thanks @Anne7 :thumbs:
Freedom!
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Post by Anne7 »

Polly wrote: September 11th, 2021, 9:30 pm
Hello, Polly :hi: :thumbs:
I don’t know why this buzzard pooped in Karl II’s nest.
Swenja wrote: September 12th, 2021, 8:46 pm
:hi:
Yes, Swenja, I remember that! You are probably right. :thumbs:
I had to look carefully to see if this bird might have been a 'rough-legged buzzard'. (Buteo lagopus)
And I still don’t know for sure. Lots of feathers on its legs! :D
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Post by Heloise »

Hello!
Anne7 wrote: September 11th, 2021, 3:29 pm There was a beautiful visitor on the nest at about 12:19. 8-)
Many thanks, Anne!
And thank you for the comments, Swenja and Polly!

I think this bird is the common buzzard (Buteo buteo) :book:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_buzzard
https://elurikkus.ee/bie-hub/species/41989?lang=en
https://et.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiireviu

Photo: a dark individual from Europe:
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File ... panek).jpg

Maybe this bird flew by while the storklets (and Kaia) were in the nest.

:wave:
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Post by Heloise »

Good evening! :hi:

I looked at photos of my beloved Karula family and decided to do a couple of photo reviews...
I wish everyone a beautiful autumn and winter and I hope we all meet again here next spring (of course with Karl II and Kaia in their nest) :rolleyes:

Image



Image

:wave:
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Post by sova »

*****
Good morning to all
Heloise wrote: September 17th, 2021, 10:03 pm ...
I looked at photos of my beloved Karula family and decided to do a couple of photo reviews...
I wish everyone a beautiful autumn and winter and I hope we all meet again here next spring (of course with Karl II and Kaia in their nest) :rolleyes:
...
:hi: Heloise yes of course .... we would not fit on the nest :mrgreen:
Thank you for the wonderful collage ... it turned out very nice
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